Yet Another Nail...

Discussions about the use and operation of SAC (Software Audio Console)

Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby RBIngraham » Tue Oct 21, 2014 2:28 pm

Darn... that wasn't it! still showing up as an attachment...
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby shmick » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:48 pm

Wow. Just wow. mr_es335 is taking being a sycophant to a whole new level.

Ya gotta wonder what the die-hard SAW folks are thinking. To me, it seems like yet another milestone of Bob's work being left in the dust of everyone else being innovative.

My favourite part is when others gang up on the newer products, claiming that they stole the idea from Bob.

The SAC Forum:

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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby jlepore » Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:20 pm

ok guys ... really, I'm trying to get some work done today, and I can't really do that with soda flying out of my nose every time I read a new posting in that chain!

Rider Friendly - a comment from the guy that had to ask about gain structure ... when is the last time anyone accidentally gave him a rider?

I work on both sides of the fence - as the FOH for a major act, and as a "house" guy for local production companies. Never in my wildest dreams would I ever accept a SAC rig for my gigs, and I would personally never offer one. I may bring mine out on a low budget gig or those "favor" gigs, but never for anything serious anymore. It has disappointed me WAY too many times. I am even renting a Pro-1 for an upcoming "16 input party" gig instead of taking my sac rig out. It's just easier, faster and more reliable.
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby jlepore » Tue Oct 21, 2014 4:21 pm

RBIngraham wrote:Darn... that wasn't it! still showing up as an attachment...


Some of them I just do a screen capture so I can attach it as a picture - which displays inline. I usually just do that if I want to show a single post.
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby RBIngraham » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:31 am

jlepore wrote:ok guys ... really, I'm trying to get some work done today, and I can't really do that with soda flying out of my nose every time I read a new posting in that chain!

Rider Friendly - a comment from the guy that had to ask about gain structure ... when is the last time anyone accidentally gave him a rider?

I work on both sides of the fence - as the FOH for a major act, and as a "house" guy for local production companies. Never in my wildest dreams would I ever accept a SAC rig for my gigs, and I would personally never offer one. I may bring mine out on a low budget gig or those "favor" gigs, but never for anything serious anymore. It has disappointed me WAY too many times. I am even renting a Pro-1 for an upcoming "16 input party" gig instead of taking my sac rig out. It's just easier, faster and more reliable.


Well it's gone now, so you can get some work done. :D

A rider is a person on horseback right? :roll:
Richard B. Ingraham
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby RBIngraham » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:37 am

shmick wrote:Wow. Just wow. mr_es335 is taking being a sycophant to a whole new level.

Ya gotta wonder what the die-hard SAW folks are thinking. To me, it seems like yet another milestone of Bob's work being left in the dust of everyone else being innovative.

My favourite part is when others gang up on the newer products, claiming that they stole the idea from Bob.

The SAC Forum:



I'm pretty sure that a lot of the old school SAW users don't even read the SAC side of the forum. It's pretty obvious from reading posts and talking to them via PM that many of them are fairly unaware of what is going on with regards to SAC and especially anything live audio.

So I wonder if these clowns realize that Bob based his products on many things that went before, just like everyone else. I don't use the word stole, because it's a bunch of BS. Behringer stole intellectual property. But Presonus or Mackie or any other digital audio console didn't steal any IP from Bob L, nor did AMP for that matter. Everything we do is based on taking what came before and improving on it. I've been on both sides of that coin, working with the company that makes the new, faster and cheap piece of software than others and takes some of their business away and watched as my lunch ticket was gobbled up by someone else that came along with the next new thing and watched the user base dry up. Happens all the time, at least in free markets. :)
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby BrentEvans » Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:26 am

RBIngraham wrote:Well it's gone now, so you can get some work done. :D


It died not three hours after Dell finally (and bluntly) got the message that he isn't the forum police. He probably whined and got it struck down... we'll see if anything changes.

Should have PDFed it while I was on the job... it was gone when I got home.
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby RBIngraham » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:32 pm

Damn sorry I missed that then....
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http://www.rbicompaudio.20m.com/
SAC details and goodies at: http://www.rbicompaudio.20m.com/SAC.html
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby IraSeigel » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:37 pm

RBIngraham wrote:Well it's gone now, so you can get some work done. :D

A rider is a person on horseback right? :roll:


Could be either gigs at rodeos or Harleyfests. I'm sure he'll do great with his SAC gear at either one. But, since he's in BC, he might wind up apologizing a bit.

If that's not PC, I don't know what is... :o
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Re: Yet Another Nail...

Postby randyhyde » Wed Oct 22, 2014 5:27 pm

shmick wrote:Wow. Just wow. mr_es335 is taking being a sycophant to a whole new level.


Yes, claiming he disagrees with my comment that building a SAC system from a junk-pile PC and the cheapest preamps around was completely laughable.

Bottom line, SAC is rapidly becoming irrelevant. Three years ago it was a promising technology that had good bang for the buck. Today, there are a few small niches where SAC is still the best product for your money, but it's rapidly losing that edge.

As bad as SAC is, I still believe that (for my use anyway) the positives are still slightly above the negatives (though I must admit that part of the "positives" is that I've already paid for my SAC system so my ROI continues to grow as long as I continue to use it). Unlike jlepore, I've only had one "show stopper" in the past couple of years (running two instances of SAC Host is *bad*); so for my use case, SAC is relatively stable. As long as I continue to use it in exactly the way I'm currently using it, SAC will probably continue to work just fine.

OTOH, if I were starting over today, I'd seriously consider the A&H GLD boards (GLD-112 at FOH, GLD-80 at monitors; would love ILive, but that's about three times the money of the GLD once the system is configured the way I'd want it). SAC works for my gigs so it doesn't make too much financial sense to switch to something else; when a gig demands something else I can just rent it.

However, I'm *far* beyond recommending SAC to anyone new. Of course, with the plethora of (cheap) digital boards out there today almost no one comes up and excitedly asks me what we're running on the PC anymore.

Sadly, SAC's day has come and gone and I don't see it ever recapturing the modicum of glory it may have once had as development is stagnant at this point and the few things it does far better than any board aren't enough to make up for the lack of a hardware control surface in most sound engineer's minds.
Cheers,
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